Beware of trust scams / Investment schemes

[JohnCapital]

Dont give your hard earned money (PED) to John Capital.

Actually I'll agree with you on this to a point.

If the ingame avatar John Teacher Capital asks anyone for peds or items, do NOT give it to him/me. This would only occur if my gold card, name & password was stolen/hacked and my ava is being used by a scammer. Or someone made an ava w/ a similar name pretending to be me.

I have never asked to borrow items ingame. I have never asked to borrow peds ingame. So if I start, just say no.

For the record, yes, under rare cases, expensive items have been loaned to me at the owners request (for various reasons) but I've never asked, and when done, I've always given back.

But that proves nothing. If I ask for items/peds ingame, you should refuse.

Any actions outside of game we'll have to deal with contracts, etc. so in case something happens there's full legal recourse.

[Mega]

I still see investment schemes popping up on PCF, I dont know why they just cant be banned to be honest.

Most of the time, they either work for a bit and then fail, or fail immediately. Notably, the ones that fail, you cant name the person who has run off with the money. Risible.

Must be the insatiable human desire to get rich.

Conmen have to be very plausible, you wont find one that isn't.

[JohnCapital]

Oh thanks for reminding me about this thread.

Just so it's official, I contacted MA directly and was told with no misunderstanding that they have no intention of trying to sell Calypso again. So my idea is DOA.

As for the rest.

I still see investment schemes popping up on PCF, I dont know why they just cant be banned to be honest.

I assume you are talking about this latest one, or maybe this one, or both. I agree only in that we both agree that the vast majority of these investment or soc funds end up in misery.

However, in this case, I agree with MA in allowing us (the players) to decide what we want to do with our money.

I completely preach non-involvement in these things, and personally avoid them like the plague, but on the other hand, I prefer a system that allows greatness by allowing failure. (Hopefully that makes sense.) Each player is given the responsibility to make the right choices with their money. And the only way these kinds of "funds" can be forbidden/banned/coded against/whatever would require such vigilance & over-the-shoulder checking by MA, that the economy would suffer too greatly.

[Spawn]

Can't we all be friends.

It would seem that Mega's first post wasn't about JC at all, even if he got banned on another forum.
Other ppl then made the thread about JC and Mega got blaimed for being totally out of line.

PPl cannot be warned about Investment schemes enough.

[Magyar]

Reread the last sentence of his first post. Im not harping on Mega. This is his business, whatever it is. However his post obviously was about this particular business between he and JC, and his last sentence was written to make sure this individual was aware of this intent.

[Mega]

Just so it is clear, the old "invest in me and i'll make you rich" thread used to pop up every 3-6 months on EF before PCF's existence.

There are 3 scenarios (that I can think of)

a) Person is honest, trustworthy, has good business sense, and has some good luck. In which case, you'll get your money back + interest

b) Person is a good guy, but something screws up over time whether in real life or in-game and "does a runner" or stops logging in. Perhaps sadly he passes away - do you have real life contact information? No?

c) Person is basically dishonest, has no intention of you ever getting your money back let alone any interest and is a thief / conman / scammer whatever name you wish to call them.

Now there is a no naming and shaming rule on this and PCF forum for good reason, it stops peoples avatar names being tarnished for malicious purposes, which is all well and good, but if someone really is up to no good, you'll have a tough job warning others. Then again, they are more than likely to create a new account anyway after a while and rinse / repeat.

Couple this with the (and I paraphrase - but its in the ToU) "All trades are final" then its almost a thief's charter to at least attempt something like this - there are other scams from the old armor painting, colouring, faux space pilot and so on, that have been going on for years.


Back to the last couple of messages, this thread was about some schemes that were appearing that I couldn't post about at the time on PCF, and yes I wasn't keen on players buying Calypso and not definitely JC in particular due to receiving a ban for breaking forum rules. The ban was warranted, I did go over the top, sometimes it happens like that, I don't appreciate people shitting in my cornflakes, but its a feature MA built into the landscape so I have to put up with it. C'est la vie.

In the mean time this thread exists as a warning, and remember the old adage, a fool and his money are soon parted.

Good luck out there.

[mastermesh]

Now there is a no naming and shaming rule on this and PCF forum for good reason, it stops peoples avatar names being tarnished for malicious purposes, which is all well and good, but if someone really is up to no good, you'll have a tough job warning others. Then again, they are more than likely to create a new account anyway after a while and rinse / repeat.

true, no name and shaming, but since there are older threads listing some investment things, and I don't think there's a rule about linking to old threads (if there is I'm sure JC or someone will edit this post as appropriate...), so here's some interesting reading related to the topic of investment schemes/scams that have flopped in the past:

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R&R
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...highlight=stts

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MMA Bigshow's Entropia Holdings:
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...ropia+holdings

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...=1#post2514534

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...ion&highlight=
=============
DWIF
http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...areholder.html
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EIF
http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

http://www.eifund.net/T3/

http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...nvestment+fund

- theoretically still exists?... Although the 90 day buy back and "guarantee" of 90 day buyback no longer does, and the fund manager seems to take a lot of "extended vacations" imho


==============
TT Project
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...The-TT-Project - not sure this one ever was really a 'fund', who knows may still be going today?!?
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Pirates Fund
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...=1#post1900368
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Hardwrath's Loans in the NBK
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...=1#post2755027
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Anshe's Investment Fund
http://dse.anshechung.com/

http://www.sluniverse.com/php/vb/oth...verse-not.html
==============
STTS
http://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/fo...highlight=stts

- failed because the Josh relied way too much on auction selling instead of selling in other ways, and also because the overhead of tracking all the trades were extremely complex since there was so many items. I fondly remember standing in the mall auction room 'waiting in line' to trade tt items to him and to get the weekly payback. One way that this really worked, just like the EIF did at first before getting rid of the 90 day buyback, in my opinion is because TT price was paid up front by those running the show, so any losses were not any different then the ones MA itself would give you at the Trade Terminal.

[JohnCapital]

true, no name and shaming, but since there are older threads listing some investment things, and I don't think there's a rule about linking to old threads (if there is I'm sure JC or someone will edit this post as appropriate...)

No, it's not against rules to link to old threads, and I do like using those old cases as educational fodder. However, just to make an example of something brought up

Then again, they are more than likely to create a new account anyway after a while and rinse / repeat.

How do we know for example that the recent Medusa Investment Fund isn't just a new ava run by MMA Big Show or Richard Devil? I doubt it's really either of these two but you get the idea.

In fact, I'm quite sure a number of scams are in fact the same person using multiple avas.

So, rather than watch for specific people, I advocate watching out for specific activities.

Remember the saying "If it's too good too be true...."

BTW, I don't see Mudkicker on the list.

[chachi1107]

well in game we are bounds by the game ula and in real world we are bound by contracts prominses and courts i can understand trying to find investers from friends in game but i think that should all be done out side of game if it is done ingame and some thing goes wrong the game or others in the game should be left out of it

[Xandra]

Hi,

one thing should be clear for everybody:

Trades in this game are final, and no angel will come to rescue you.

If any honest person would make an EU investment fonds he would provide his RL data, real (printed & mailed) contracts, conditions suiting the different legal systems of the different countries, and, maybe, security by a bank.

This doesn't mean that anything like this made purely in EU as Avatar to Avatar business is dishonest, but at least it isn't professional. And it's not wise to spent your money to not-so-professional fonds, right?
This might be OK for small sums, between good friends. But, as we know, money loves to eat friendships, so don't try this at home!

I'd have had no problem with JC's idea, from what I've seen this was made in an honest and professional way. Too bad that my piggie bank is close to starving ...

Btw., +REP to both Mega & JC to get your problem settled in such a civilized way!


And, maybe a word to JC here, since his thread is closed:

Think big! As some have already posted it wouldn't make sense to buy FPC. Buy MA instead! This would be what this game might need. Buying FPC would only set you in a sub position, depending of the crumbs that MA would drop to you.
You'd need to spent more money for lawyers then for game development.

I'd really appreciate if the PP's (some of them ...), and maybe a 3rd party, would ally, get some funds raised, take over MA and finally start to develop this game to the potential it has.

Have a good time!