Virtual Reality Public Transport IPO - Discussion

[KikkiJikki]

The way I read NDs plan I think he is focussing on links with other RCEs that he thinks will inevitably come along.

But I agree there are additional opportunities for fraud and scamming.

[Andy]

ND!

You have to understand, that offered fee in 1 PED s too big for most players, and even for me (I can use TP for 10-50 times per day, because I'm a miner). If there will be paid TP with a fee 1 PED (this means 1-5$ per day or 30-150$ per month), I'll stop my activity, or I should use Sleipnir, so my turnover will automatically decreased (due to I need to fly to my spots every time when I need to do a mining job), or I'll think about leaving from this expensive game.

You have to understand, that this IPO will suffer only players with active professions (miners, hunters, resource gatherers, and sweaters, or dung collectors). Crafters can use auction and do not use TP's. It is not fair.

You have to understand, that after the introduction of fees will decrease the number of teleport uses in 3-5-10 times, and all calculations with billions is just shit, because these 'calculations' use 'normal mode' of TP using, and not the future state. You'll see what happens, hehe

You have to understand, that this IPO will simply increase cost of play, but not give additional money (this will not help to attract new players, but it can cause a reverse process, and people will leave)

And finally, you have to understand, that you are not a president of EU (because there are no democratic ingame elections, just farce in Facebook, which many players, including me, do not use), you are just planet partner, so all you want to do, is just business, which lead only to your personal enrichment. So stay away from our money with these shitty ideas or conduct experiments on your own planet. We all know, that most players will leave RT after that.

[harmony]

Well i can't say you don't have visions and dreams. The thing about those is that they take decades to realize.
Maybe trade some of those dreams for some living in the present and try to use your influence to improve the game now?

[Andy]

Well i can't say you don't have visions and dreams. The thing about those is that they take decades to realize.
Maybe trade some of those dreams for some living in the present and try to use your influence to improve the game now?

I do not think that to make all teleporters taxed is too hard, and takes a lot of time for MA. I think, they can do it in one-two day. All the rest - yes, we will wait for years (and maybe it will be not fully implemented, as always, like stables, space missions, voting system and other things), you're right.
MA can say (as with a promised space missions): sorry guys, we have other important things and we will not have plans to realise all other functionality this year (and maybe several next years). So, Deeds will be sold, $10 Mil will be recieved by MA, TP Deeds will pay to its owners, and all Deed owners perhaps will be happy. But unhappy will be only active players, and of course depositors.

Also, perhaps it can happen that some teleporters will take 100 PED per one use (as a bug after update )

Also, I measured, trying to reach one of my faraway mining spot (~22 km) on Sleipnir from my Shop (my base) at Celeste North takes me about 25 min and 0,52 PED oil. Or I can reach it using TP Chip IV for 5 PED (including MU) and very fast. Or using taxed TP system for 1 PED. So if I want check all my spots (about 6-10) each day, and usually I do it not once, I will need to spend too much money per month. This sum can easy reach up to $100-$200. This tax is incredible high even for me! If all mined resources will rise up in price (atleast up to 125-500% (from 102-200)), I'll do not care about tax. If MU will remain as today - my plan is to sell out, cash out, and go into a big group of dung/fruit collectors. This is because I do not have enough time and patience to reach all my spots using Sleipnir. On the other side, all crafters (they are reachest players!) will not pay this tax, because they mostly using Auction and do not need to move for their activity.
All players, whos turnover is about $30-150 per day, may stop playing due to high additional taxes. Players, whos turnover is higher than $200-1000 per day - can play as always. My daily turnover is about $50-100 now, so $100 - 10% (to MA pockets) and - $3-5 to ND (TP system) pockets, it is just additional fee, and nothing more. Summary, if I will do a mining jobs in LA with 5% tax: 10%(MA)+5%(LA)+5%(TP)=20% of taxes. For break these taxes and additional fees at Auction, I need average MU in 125% or more. For me it is still possible, but very hard to reach, usually I have 115-118% MU. For most miners and all hunters including ubers this is impossible. For those whos turnover is less than $20-30, addtional fee in $1-2 per day is absolutely unacceptable.

I'm also sure, that my investing into my Shop (about $4700) will be lost after this IPO, because noone will use taxed TP to reach my Shop instead buying something using of Auction (because it will be cheaper). Most other shop owners will lose their customers too. Of course, ND and MA do not care about it.

And one more question: How about Toulan, there is not possible to use vehicles! No alternative choice, except TP chips.

And I'm sure, if the tax will be about 0.02 PED, most of players will not count their jumps. This may bring more money, than with the tax in 1 PED. My 50 jumps x 0,02 PED = 1 PED per day. This is fully acceptable, if MA need a money, and it will not affected most players gameplay.

This was a great game in the past. Unfortunately, this WAS a great game.

[Ubering]

This is a terrible idea.. The cost to play, to stay on the same level as other players, has already gone skyhigh with all the buffs that has been introduced. I bet the fee's will go directly on your pedcard?

And now your first action as VR president is increasing the cost to play?! You should really listen to what the community wants.. Start by having items in loot and NOT in the webshop for example.

There are soooooooooo many things that have been bugged for way to long now, and you choose to add something instead of fixing shit first. I know i'll be gone when TP fee's are introduced

[SquirrellyWrath]

OK. stepping outside of EU and trying to realize the plan you have here... What other game/platform/system have you approached with this monetary fee for teleporting?? Hopefully there is at least one other "vr" "mmo" whatever that you are dealing with.... if not then EU will be the only playerbase paying for this plan?

[NEVERDIE]

I do not think that to make all teleporters taxed is too hard, and takes a lot of time for MA. I think, they can do it in one-two day. All the rest - yes, we will wait for years (and maybe it will be not fully implemented, as always, like stables, space missions, voting system and other things), you're right.
MA can say (as with a promised space missions): sorry guys, we have other important things and we will not have plans to realise all other functionality this year (and maybe several next years). So, Deeds will be sold, $10 Mil will be recieved by MA, TP Deeds will pay to its owners, and all Deed owners perhaps will be happy. But unhappy will be only active players, and of course depositors.

Also, perhaps it can happen that some teleporters will take 100 PED per one use (as a bug after update )

Also, I measured, trying to reach one of my faraway mining spot (~22 km) on Sleipnir from my Shop (my base) at Celeste North takes me about 25 min and 0,52 PED oil. Or I can reach it using TP Chip IV for 5 PED (including MU) and very fast. Or using taxed TP system for 1 PED. So if I want check all my spots (about 6-10) each day, and usually I do it not once, I will need to spend too much money per month. This sum can easy reach up to $100-$200. This tax is incredible high even for me! If all mined resources will rise up in price (atleast up to 125-500% (from 102-200)), I'll do not care about tax. If MU will remain as today - my plan is to sell out, cash out, and go into a big group of dung/fruit collectors. This is because I do not have enough time and patience to reach all my spots using Sleipnir. On the other side, all crafters (they are reachest players!) will not pay this tax, because they mostly using Auction and do not need to move for their activity.
All players, whos turnover is about $30-150 per day, may stop playing due to high additional taxes. Players, whos turnover is higher than $200-1000 per day - can play as always. My daily turnover is about $50-100 now, so $100 - 10% (to MA pockets) and - $3-5 to ND (TP system) pockets, it is just additional fee, and nothing more. Summary, if I will do a mining jobs in LA with 5% tax: 10%(MA)+5%(LA)+5%(TP)=20% of taxes. For break these taxes and additional fees at Auction, I need average MU in 125% or more. For me it is still possible, but very hard to reach, usually I have 115-118% MU. For most miners and all hunters including ubers this is impossible. For those whos turnover is less than $20-30, addtional fee in $1-2 per day is absolutely unacceptable.

I'm also sure, that my investing into my Shop (about $4700) will be lost after this IPO, because noone will use taxed TP to reach my Shop instead buying something using of Auction (because it will be cheaper). Most other shop owners will lose their customers too. Of course, ND and MA do not care about it.

And one more question: How about Toulan, there is not possible to use vehicles! No alternative choice, except TP chips.

And I'm sure, if the tax will be about 0.02 PED, most of players will not count their jumps. This may bring more money, than with the tax in 1 PED. My 50 jumps x 0,02 PED = 1 PED per day. This is fully acceptable, if MA need a money, and it will not affected most players gameplay.

This was a great game in the past. Unfortunately, this WAS a great game.

Your Math is very valid and everything you point out will absolutely have to be taken into account.
However what also needs to be considered is that the entire economy might get a boost with this IPO if its handled correctly. Itis designed to attract significantly more users through the Jobs and Conscription which when combined with initiatives from MA to stimulate more crafting and demand for resources can have a dramatic impact on your overall numbers..

The Transport system and associated token costs will be balanced very carefully as will the other transport costs..

Yes if You take this on its own and out of context of it successfully bringing lots more users and tens or hundreds of millions of dollars of investment, then I see how bad it can look.

But Please look at the overall plan, its not just one thing.... Most importantly this is a high concept idea to underwrite the creation of jobs in VR.. I want to raise billions, I want to show the world we can have a massive VR RCE Market place.. (Ofc the platform will need to grow to accommodate millions of players, I also think a significant part of that user base would be utilizing APPs and other platforms to connect to the RCE.

The Reason that the balancing and dev of EU s not moving as fast as we would all like is because the platform needs to be growing at the same time to fund it.

I certainly am discussing with MA the general economy and am being assured steps are being taken to increase manufacturing and the demand for resources..

If the steps are not taken or not successful, I am able to challenge them on their choices. I can present ideas from the community. But I'm not the CEO of MA or chief balancing officer. As Prez of VR I am an outsider geared to creating initiatives to bridge worlds and to bring EU to the forefront of VR where it really should be given that it is an extraordinary RCE Universe. Yes the economy is out of whack and there are so many reasons why. Also there are internal politics at MA that have to be navigated to push for Dev...

I will do as much as I can, but we can see the Entropia Player base doesn't really want that from me. They would rather have someone they have confidence in to address MA regarding balancing and the economy... That's fine I didn't run for president of Entropia Universe. I wouldn't have... What's the point, I can already communicate with MA regarding these issues. I can pitch them ideas... I want to work to show the world the value of RCE worlds. I want to champion the best of EU.

I think now is a really good time for the community to find some player representatives, who they have faith in and charge them with the task of putting to together a priority list to present to MA. In my capacity i will support these reps in presenting these plans to MA.

I want the economy to be stronger for the Players. That's what I want. I know why things that seem to be obvious to the players are not being implemented.. I want to help facilitate the Dev we need to improve the overall balancing.
to do that I have to generate renewed interest in the platfom. Banner ads alone are not enough to fuel significant growth. We need initiatives. People talk about advertising, but there are many companies with deeper pockets than MA who are driving the cost of new user acquisition up.. if only it were as easy as putting an Ad on TV or in a magazine.. The numbers aren't there...

We have to re-invent and think outside the box...

But enough I don't want to sell you or anyone else on the initiative right now... I have put it out there, digest it, think about what I'm trying to do and I'll think about what everyone's saying...

MA is congress at the end of the day, my initiatives have to get past them.. I was warned that some of the existing Population would be up in arms... But I believe that there is a great opportunity here and I will continue to champion it...

to think I don't care about the players is unrealistic, if the players are not happy, I'm out of business. My planet will die.

[OZtwo]

to think I don't care about the players is unrealistic, if the players are not happy, I'm out of business. My planet will die.

This is exactly why you need to stop this. But again I know you cannot because all you typed was from MA and not you.

Lets look at EU right now. 2 planets are dead. 1 just starting trying to get somewhere 1 one that just had a major down grade (Sorry 2 planets - forgot yours) and then MA off working on other application. What other company would want to join EU? If anything, sad to say, they would create their own RCE network and move on from there.

What you need to do, if you even have the power, is to stop this here and work with MA to make what we have already better. Fix bugs. Give us some GREAT updates and/or features. Make it so more players will want to play the game.

See what you are doing in a way is giving US the EU players a door way to leave. See you keep on saying more players could show up if at some point in the future other RCE games came out but forget that well, that door is two ways. We could go through those new created doors and never come back. On top of that these DOORs would make MA have to invest even more money to keep up with the other RCE companies.

Sad to say this is a lost post because all you are here is a MA representative trying to sell us on the next VU.

Again I fully understand what it is you are thinking here. But at least wait until we have other games to port to. Don't make this another Hanger idea.

Why are you trying to kill this game? Why?

[Andy]

МА (or you) can endlessly to introduce new features, taxes, and bugs, leaving the old ideas and old 'new' functions unfinished.
You can not look into existing game issues over the years, which users clearly indicate to you, and which is occurred through the fault of the developers in the previous updates.
You can ignore existing bugs and exploits.
But if you, without correcting the obvious bugs, simply add another new tax (and this is new tax in 5-10% in addition to all other ingame taxes, let's use right names for it), simply in order to earn more than $10 million for you and MA, and force players to pay extra money in the future, developers look at least disgusting in the eyes of their customers.
Customers will throw them.
Yes, on their place may come the others, but at some point you will kick all players so much, that they leave almost all, and at the same time you just do not have enough money to pay off with them.

You can say too many nice words for as long as you want, but we can talk about the development of the platform only when the platform is working perfectly, no problems, bugs, errors, customer complaints, etc. When your customers are not satisfied with the your project, because it does not work good, or does not work the way you stated, it strongly undermines the credibility of any new idea. Today, as a player who plays a total 8 years almost every day (from almost 10 years of existence of my account), I argue that this is true. Platform is not perfect, too many problems inside, but you ask again for $10 mil and new tax. Great idea! Greedy customers will pay to us! Not all customers will pay... some of them will continue parasitic living.

And this is your new, enthusiastically offered idea is just another tax for me, about $100-200 per month. Just for comparison, the income from my 1000x AUD (1:200 of all released AUDs) is only $35-40 per month. To some of the players may be all the same, but I'm do not have plans to deposit, invest, or buying new deeds (in order to compensate TP fees), to provide to you these $10 mil.

Yes, idea may be implemented, without any IPO and with lower taxes. Yes, 1-2-5 and even 10 PEC it is might be not enough for jobs, but it is acceptable tax. 1 PED is not acceptable.

[Oleg]

Yes the economy is out of whack and there are so many reasons why.

Among these reasons are unbalanced items on Rocktropia. Maybe you should start there.