Clarification about Entropia banking operations

[AlphaGeek]

Protecting the newcomers? LOL Most of the new arrivals have no peds or property to be scammed of! That's the largest load of hooey I've seen to date.

Try increasing the spin, Marco. The picture isn't blurry enough to keep us from seeing it yet.

If you were really interested in protecting the poor innocent noobs, MA would have been agressively (and visibly... good for PR you know "Look! MA is keeping the system safe for you!") going after the scammers at PA, correcting the flaws with the mentor system, and not targeting players that are trusted by the community. If I were to use suck a service, I would certainly NOT use the new 500 pound gorillas on the block, but one of the ones established by credible players within the game.

We trust ourselves more than we trust you Marco. MA needs to work on that.

AG

PS as a side note, the "Booking list of busted avatars" seems like a good idea, and *might* help you to win some credibility back.

[BlackMagicWoman]

I think that MA should let the ones that provided this service before they implemented the bank licenses to continue their business.
Considering that Teilik was doing this for quite a while BEFORE all this change happened, CBE must be let to continue its pursue on this.
It would be a fair compromise that would satisfy somehow both MA and us, the players.

[BlackHawk]

No, it would NOT. The trades mult be free. If a scam is reported, it should be investigated, but if I whant, I can give for free or mor more than market value to anyone I whant any item I whant. I don't give valuble items because of this crappy system, and therefore I never borow anything. But if people do that and is fine by them, let them.

[EyeContact]

Everybody is talking about Akoz & Co.
What are the consequences for the H&R circle? You need to be invited into that, so you could consider them a "group of trusting friends", correct?

edit: I know it's not the same format, but Akoz & Co could setup the "ATC Circle" and only provide loans to a "group of trusted friends".

[Aziphirael]

So I assume that Neverdie isn't a credible player now because he owns a Bank License? Then again maybe its Horses for Courses as it were on who to trust.

Is this event going to break the back of EU? Probably not. The same was said of things like the CND controversy and various VUs that nerfed bits and pieces. People leave, they come back. New people join whose expectations are different to the old-timers, who are perhaps less jaded and probably part of the silent majority who don't frequent places like EF.

And people keep on depositing ;-) And as long as people deposit they are accepting the status quo. I suspect that many people here have contributed in some measure to the 26,900,000PED that was deposited already in the first quarter of 2007.

[Da Snake]

Originally Posted by Marco|MindArk

To clarify the clarification - MA will target avatars who state they offer loan services (or equal) as business (and not having a virtual banking license). Private loans, the borrowing or lending of items/money between friends, is not the target.

Newcomers come to Entropia, they have read about the banking license and assume baning is safe in Entropia. All banking. When they get fooled by a scammer bank avatar they lose all trust in Entropia and in MindArk. It creates support cases, grief and anger. Many newcomers doesn't really understand the concept of virtual items having real value until after something bad happens. This time we wanted to act before the situation gets out of hand, and to protect the community and add safety to the virtual environment. Many of the newcomers today don't have the knowledge or insight of the culture and mechanics in Entropia, thus meaning MA must add means to protect them.

As to scammers in general, MA is locking accounts due to scams and frauds. Maybe we should have a weekly posting of "Accounts locked since last week" somewhere to have transparancy, maybe we should add the number of warnings an avatar has when people interact with the avatar. Obviously there are things that can be improved.

Marco-
Thank you for clarifying this makes more sense. Next time, I would not use the term "scammers" so lightly. I think this message would have got through without calling potentially legitimate businessmen "scammers".

As for protecting the banks, MA is just doing what they need to do, regulate business in EU.

As any economist will tell you, protecting property rights is one of the most important, if not the most important foundation of an economic or political system.

In this case, MA is protecting the Bank owner’s rights to their license. A strong economy is a balance between free market and regulation, and in this case a little regulation was needed.

MA used some really stupid wording but the idea to protect the rights of the bank licensee’s is the correct choice for a stronger EU.

[Defiler]

On a side note:

Let's assume that some ppl continue their loan service.

- They make the agreement outside EU. (eg. PM's through EF)
- Ingame they meet and just exchange goods for peds. (Since EU economy is dynamic --> NO FIXED PRICES FOR ANYTHING and TRADING is encouraged, why wouldn't i want to buy back my sold item a few weeks later at a higher market price?)
- Even if this kind of trading happens ALOT so what? (players in here are just nutty as in RL)

I have heard of a lot if thin ice manoevers but this wins with miles...

I really would love to seethe first lockdown for this. Lawyer up and play free for the rest of your life...

As for the 5 bankers who probably now face a boycott of their services even before MA has implemented their "tools" and buildings. A smart court will grant you the exclusivity of the tools, banks and some other checks and balances MA created for your banks but the right to force others out of business that launched the idea long before you were even here? No way.
Stop playing American cutthroat menaces (even there they don't work anymore, check La Salle if you a HINT) and join the game on a fair playing field.

P.S.: Look up the meaning of the term "shooting oneself in the foot".


Still don't like the idea of pawnshops though.... (and that is what they seem to be so far.. glorified pawnshops)

[burnsey]

I wonder how much more spin MA can throw at this.

This is my tribute to MA:
the "Spin Doctors"

Little miss, little miss, little miss cant be wrong
Aint nobody gonna bow no more when you sound your gong.
Little miss, little miss, little miss cant be wrong
Whatcha gonna do to get into another one of these rock n roll
Songs?

Other peoples thoughts they aint your hand-me-downs
Would it be so bad to simply turn around
You cook so well, all nice and french
You do your brain surgery too, with a monkey wrench


SO do you think MA will yield or put the authoritative boot down and stick with all loaning businesses are scammers.

[kira-red]

Originally Posted by Marco|MindArk

Newcomers come to Entropia, they have read about the banking license and assume baning is safe in Entropia. All banking.

so, a newcomer with no money or anything walks down the ramp in port atlantis. said newcomer wanders around and stumbles upon the shiney bank building. wow, they think the stories are all true. so, they look and see how it works but realise they down't have anything to pawn.

the newcomer then deposits some money to get started in the game. they talk to people and learn that they can buy shares in the shiney bank. the representives assure them that the unsecured, fake shares are backed by that nice shiney bank and they'll be investing in the economy of EU.

newcomer thinks this is great an makes an unoffical, out-of-game transaction to buy some fake stocks. after all, the bank has the backing of MA and the owners invested money to purchase the licence from MA. MA must approve of the idea. newcomer, after some time, notices that the fake stocks and fake market have no true value and are not underwritten by anyone and have no in-game presence.

the newcomer realises that the only way to recover his investment is to propagate the deception to drive up the price and recruit another mark to buy his fake stocks. the ethicial player quits in disgust. the non-ethical one propagates the scheme.

so, who was just swindled, marco?

and this is only the tip of the iceburg.

Originally Posted by Mikass

Every reseller can start selling "shares" like that with no regulation, scamming ppl at will.

marco, you guys really have to get down from your high horse and start paying attention to your game. without the underpinings of the game and the people who actually play it, all these so-called services are useless.

[Mikah]

Originally Posted by burnsey

I wonder how much more spin MA can throw at this.

They won't, they are already working on their next project (Entropia Blog)...
When you can't handle the heat, turn your head somewhere else ...

The official Entropia Universe blog