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06-06-2008, 14:23
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#52 | ||||||||
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Prowler
    
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They DID say it... So... for all of you that think MA did this without saying it will eventually be done, check the web archive... From April 19, 2006; http://web.archive.org/web/200604190...rich/5268.html Quote:
 EDIT: After reading the web archive for the pet info page everytime it changed... it seems that pets were always are meant to die.... it also seems that pets SHOULD take 200 bars to stable... They don't seem to specifically say 'if your pet has 0 energy it will die', but they do say that if it has 0 energy when you desert it, it will die... so is leaving a pet in the stable forever considering deserting it? I would think so... Last edited by Dion Red Strike; 06-06-2008 at 14:41.. |
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06-06-2008, 15:56
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#53 | |||||||
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Prowler
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I would have thought that when they changed a feature/ bug in the game which influenced so many people (both in terms of people who have conducted business in good faith and those that have bought deeds in good faith) then they would openly announce the change. MA didn't put this change into the VU list and has only slowly confirmed the change ...so the messages from support seem to have been that they were initially confused about the change (we will check with developers etc) and finally stating that the change was intended. My support case is still open btw. Two years ago Daki Stalker pet deeds were sold for 60 ped and Exar Stalker for 20 ped...recently the came down to about 10-15% of the original price. A lot of people will have 100's of deeds in storage. So these are not inconsequential amounts of money which MA has just wiped of the value of some Avi's. |
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06-06-2008, 18:27
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#54 | |||||||
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Prowler
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i.e. You buy a 1912 penny from a coin shop for $400. You're penny is only worth a penny. The government gaurantees you they will give you a brand spanking new penny for that old penny, not 400 bucks for it. If they released a bunch of the same penny from a vault, it's still only worth, you guessed it, a penny. If some collector sells of thousands of that same penny, it's still only worth $0.01. Just because you paid 400 bucks for it doesn't make it worth it. Now, as far as support goes, they don't know every single aspect of the game. Goto McDonalds, ask the customer service rep (a.k.a. the cash register operator) what the fat content is on a large fry. He'll probably respond with 'Duh, uh, lemme go get my manager'. So, I'm positive support was confused. They can't possibly know everything. They should have a good grasp of how everything works, but because the universe is constantly changing, if they were updated on everything, we'd have no support... they'd constantly be in conferences about changes.... or, alternatively, we'd have days were support went missing... I'm sure they are updated on the major changes tho... So, in defense of MA, I think you are completely wrong on this one. And those people that have 'thousands of deeds in their inventory' are insane, and market speculators. <sarcasm> By the way, you might wanna stock up on rare resources (zand, himi, etc), because they don't drop nearly enough... don't worry, the new planets that are coming will have none of these resources to mine up.... </sarcasm> |
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06-06-2008, 20:40
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#55 | |||||||
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Prowler
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Intrinsic Value of items: Correct the value is TT - this isn't the issue Right of MA to do whatever they want: its their game Right of players to have clear communication from MA: It they want us to trust them then they need to be clear and upfront about changes Support: I don't expect McDonald's like staff and so far the support staff I have talked to on the phone and who have responded to support cases have been professional and clear. This time the response was very, very confused As for the view that MA don't have a grip on the development of the game and understand the impacts of their actions: I don't think this is true and if it was I would be cashing out now. I think they understood the impact but didn't communicate it to their support or us - and I think that is a breach of trust and something which they should at least apologize for. As for your view on speculators and traders etc...hmmm people have different views. I think you are naive if you think that most of the long term players in this game haven't speculated on the price of items in this game. The 'speculation' on pet deeds was one that was open to all (either by taming a pet themselves or buying one) and was undertaken by lots and lots of players. This was a 'speculation' that harmed no one and potentially offered a benefit to a wide number of people. MA have nerfed this without communicating this fact to players. Leaving traders in pet deeds in a very difficult position - a useless stock and even more upsetting - unintentionally mis-selling deeds. PS we can make this all nasty, sarcastic and and flamey if you wish, however, wouldn't it be nicer to discuss this in a reasoned way? |
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06-07-2008, 00:22
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#56 | |||||||
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Prowler
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The truth is, they intended to do this initially. The problem was there was a bug. The bug obviously either worked itself out, as bugs sometimes do, or they made a direct effort to fix it. I would like to suggest that the code that caused the bug was probably unrelated to the bug itself, and by changing the offending code, the bug disappeared. They probably were fixing another bug, and this bug stopped, hence, they didn't know they fixed it. Killed two birds with one stone, as it were. I'm usually fairly good at anologies, so I'll try one on this... Your car shakes at high speeds because one of your lug nuts is loose (the nut that holds the tire on for those that have never changed a tire). Your brakes pads need to be changed. You change your brakes, and retighten the lug nuts, and the shaking is fixed. You didn't realize the loose lugs nuts were the cause, but by changing the breaks, and going back to tighten the lugs nuts to put the tire back on, you fixed the shaking. You never knew the cause of the shaking...'. So, you spouses asks you about it... what did you do to fix the shaking? You haven't driven that car yet, because you were busy driving your (much better) car. So you say 'huh, it's fixed, cool, lemme check it out'. You drive the car and return saying 'Yeah, it's fixed'. Spouse says 'what did you do to fix it?', you respond by saying 'It musta been the brake pads'..... Yes, speculation. But, this universe is worse than working on a car. You tighten down one thing, another thing breaks. You change the radiator, and the water pump breaks... Or, you change the radiator, and realize that the problem wasn't the radiator, it was the water pump. Or, you change the radiator, and all of a sudden the head starts leaking because of the better water pressure.... Changing one thing in this universe more often than not affects many other areas. I can only imagine they test each and every part they think about, but can't possibly check everything. Imagine how long it would take to check everything, everytime they made a VU? We'd have 1 VU every 4 or 5 years. They'd be making a whole new game, once every few years, basically. One of the attractions to this game is it's every evolving structure. Always adding new places, and things to do. When I started, apartments weren't out. Taming wasn't heard of. Cash cards weren't out. There was like 1 person in the support department. Look at this page; http://web.archive.org/web/200412231....com/Index.ajp Tell me how far we've come. Now, try to tell me that they know everything. I don't expect the support department to be McDonlads cashiers, but I seriously don't expect them to know everything. That would be the same as asking anyone in this world (earth) how everything in the world works. It's a universe we're talking about here, not a game. Would you know how to fix a car engine? Do brain surgery? manufacture computers? Make a Big Mac? Can you bake a cake? Take the safety off a gun? Program an SQL database? Some of these things may be easy for you, but hard for another person. But, regardless, these things are done each and everyday on Earth. Not many people know how to do all of them, if anyone. The support department tries to be our mechanic, brain surgeon, computer manufacturer, McDonalds cashier, Baker, Gun Specialist, and database programmer. We can't possibly expect them to know/remember everything all of the time. Becuase, in actuallity, they are the customer support for the brain surgeon, mechanic, etc. They may, or may not, know exactly what the surgeon or the mechanic did. But, they can only go off of the notes they are given, and I wouldn't expect my mechanic (maybe my brain surgeon) to take notes of each bolt he removed, each nut he tightened down, or each hose he attached. So, when I call the customer service person for my mechanic, I can't simply ask 'did he tighten the third headbolt down to 74 PSI?' and expect the customer service person to know right away. They'd go ask the mechanic. The machanice would respond, duh, the recommended tightening for aq rebuild on that vehicle is 68-72, I tightened it down to 70 psi. While the original recommendation is 74 psi, because of the age of the engine, this would crack the head. Bug fixed.... Yes, you are correct that we shouldn't get into a flame war, but I often find myself explaining 'how life works' to people that just don't get it, and find myself in a 'piss on this' sorta attitude. I play whack-a-mole a lot around here.... I whack one misbelief down only to find another 2 popping up... so I break out the big guns... small words... ~Red |
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06-07-2008, 00:49
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#57 | ||||||
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Prowler
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I am sorry Red - I just simply disagree with you.
MA should have known what the impact would be on the economics of the system. If they didn't then they are incompetent developers of a system and fundamentally out of touch with the community which provides them with money. Taming and selling deeds has been a legitimate and high profile element of the economics of the game for over two years. They didn't know just doesn't wash. If we run with your analogy for a while- I am playing a high cost/ high quality game. I expect high quality service - if I want a mechanic who fiddles around with the system then there are lots of alternatives. I stick with MA because I believe they know what they are doing. And yes when many of us 'old timers' started there were lots of differences and bugs...and we have seen lots of improvements -the game is significantly different to the one I started playing all those years ago. This isn't just mindless MA bashing. I personally now feel awful - I feel that MA have changed the rules of the game over night and NOT TOLD ME THE RULES HAVE CHANGED. I feel betrayed and let down by MA - not because the rules changed - but because they didn't tell me. |
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06-07-2008, 01:28
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#58 | |||||||
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Prowler
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Because of the 'economic' impact that you speak of, I would pose this to you; Would you have them turn off taming until the bug was fixed (for 2 years)? There are many bugs that often help the user. Often, MA knows of these bugs. It's not really their job to tell you when they fix em, really. It's more their job to tell you when they are there. I'm more pissed when they don't tell me about a bug, than when they fix one, and don't tell me it's fixed. If there's a bug that they know about, and don't fix, they usually say something in the notes somewhere. They also put lots of fixes in the notes, but not always all of them. They also don't put 'this is a bug' if it's no longer a bug... Basically, what you've just said is your mad they fixed a bug, and didn't say they fixed it, right? Seems to be a stupid reason to be mad Much more important things to be mad about.... |
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06-07-2008, 02:40
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#59 | ||||||
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Alpha
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They could have simply mentioned that they fixed it in the VU notes. As it was, we had to open support cases to report the change. This was a big change, similar to when they fixed the hanger bug and did not allow renting any more. I remember them announcing that they had made that change.
We may not have been happy about it, but at least we would have known. |
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